MMO rambling on fohguild.org again

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Originally Posted by Barnum Would love to see this. I really think a lot of valuable dev time could be put to better use creating a larger more in-depth world, rather then the areas so many people seem to rush thru just to get to the top level anyways. I like the fact in Eve you enter the world in a somewhat safer area, but can immediately move out and take your chances or join friends who are months/years ahead of you skillwise. Your not going to be flying a titan right away, but you can still get into things quick enough.

I've had the same thought for a while now. Every time a game comes out that has quest-based progression I recall this line of thinking. Why quests, let alone level-based progression? What a huge waste of development time. Not only do you have to make tons and tons of content just to placate players through the process of getting to the endgame, but if you only have one path for the players to progress through they'll complain about lack of choice/options.

Not to mention the quests are such horrible filler anyway - I know everyone here is the same way with the 10-bear-asses quests where we've become these human scanners, able to instantly look at paragraphs of text to decipher key numbers and locations and go find the bears who have the specific asses necessary for quest completion. Frankly I still prefer EQ camp grinding to that, although I'm fairly sure I'm in the minority on that point haha.

I mean again looking at UO, or even EVE as a more recent example (which we know today is successful as far as profit and stability/growth goes). The content in these games is laughable. When really they should be the ones laughing at the diku games. Everquest on it's 16th expansion... WoW redoing their entire game and stats system due to mudflation and other mechanic changes (flying mounts etc.)... it's a joke when you have systems in place to either bypass this content or create it dynamically. Now I'm not saying some random EVE solar system has the same depth and beauty of any given WoW zone, certainly they do not. However, the development cost difference is inarguable.

I'm not saying this is the Final Solution for all MMO players. Obviously it's a different market. Hell, it might even be a niche market at this point with how engraved into people's minds level/quest-based progression is. But I highly doubt it's not a profit-worthy share of the MMO market waiting to be tapped (specifically, a current-gen fantasy "sandbox" mmo). And for unproven, small developers looking to stake their claim in the market, this really seems like a given as to where they should focus their design - NOT on the massive content heavy timesinks that are diku/wow-likes.

In reply to an fohguild thread on 11/3/2009.

Reply about Graphics in MMOs on fohguild.org

I agree, good graphics are completely unnecessary. I can safely say that none of my fondest memories in MMOs have anything to do with graphics and everything to do with atmosphere/setting.

It actually goes beyond that, to the point of which when graphical "improvements" have ruined games for me. Two easy examples are UO and EQ. Luclin literally made me quit EQ because of the new and foreign graphics. The game didn't feel the same and I hated the fact that there was a chance people were rendering me in the new, terrible stick-up-the-ass SoL model. The original EQ player models may have been lacking polygons but they had a ton of style and familiarity. UO... well, that's a no brainer. That 3d client tore the heart and soul right out of the game (although it was gameplay stuff that made me stop playing). I do admit that Kingdom Reborn actually looks pretty good today, but those original 2d graphics are still just so gorgeous to me that I can't see any need to waste time replacing them. And they definitely stand the test of time with what people are doing on player run shards.

Posted on fohguild.org on 11/2/2009.

Bemoaning Questing on the fohguild.org forums

I'm pretty much of the mind that quests should either be done really well or hardly done at all. I might be alone here, but social grinding/instance running is way more fun to me than mindless questing, and questing takes WAY more resources to produce. Plus, with having to create questlines, it's to the point where if you even have two quest paths to level up with people will claim you don't have enough content because they get bored after 1 alt. Really seems senseless to go the quest route anymore.

So yeah, quest-based leveling = tons of content creation for - I assume - not much gain. Has anyone ever met someone who actually reads every single quest and enjoys them? Sure, you have the occasional fun quests in every game, the bombing runs and such, these should certainly remain. I just think the resources dedicated to making the hundreds/thousands of quests are better spent elsewhere, like making a more fun dynamic system in it's place. AO did fairly well here with the mission system, for its time.

Personally I was really excited for WAR's whole "oh, you've killed 10 bandits who are raiding our village but DIDN'T get the quest for it? Well, here's your reward anyway!" - sadly they botched it as expected and it was just some gimmicky useless system. I really like exploration for the sake of exploration and being rewarded for it (roaming around with a group and finding new and interesting xp camps in early era EQ/new expansions was probably the peak of this facet), but 95% of the time you're just following the dotted line and watching your numbers increase. I dunno, it sounds a bit hypocritical when I was just saying how I can't play without quest markers - I actually PREFER walking around "in the dark", but only when I am actively finding goals and rewards on my own. When I'm walking around in the dark trying to find rabid bears, not just regular bears, to get some rabid bear asses, that's when I become annoyed.

go go rambling

In reply to a fohguild.org forum thread on 10/25/2009.

Discussing King's Field on Destructoid

Wow, how did I miss this article? More proof that Ashley is awesome. The King's Field series is probably one of the most underrated series of all time. I was actually really disheartened when I saw that Demon's Souls was third person. Something about KF really makes the first person view very powerful... I'm not sure why or how; every little nuance from falling into a pit and turning around to see a slew of monsters, to bending over to pick up an herb really makes you feel like you're there in the caverns. I think even the annoying aspects of the game like the slow turning and the limited view distance amplified this effect, as odd as it sounds - the game just wouldn't have been what it was if you could do instant 180o spins ala Quake (and trust me, I'm a huge quake nerd). Another "bad" aspect that really worked was the fact that you were just so alone. Towns were few and far between and barely had more than a shopkeeper. The enemies in the game were either alien in nature or hauntingly inhuman and provided no comfort whereas in other games sometimes even the enemies prevent you from feeling alone. Not the case in KF.

As well, I love how open-ended the first games were. I know this term is thrown around a lot but KF truly was nonlinear. From the very moment you're dropped on the shore and listening to the atmospheric music and echoing ambiance you have at least half a dozen different options for paths to traverse. Glad to see other people remembering the games so fondly.

Also, a couple more songs for your listening pleasure: Passage for a Monk http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDapXvnjAhI and West Coast http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yyIjbs_TPgM

In reply to a Destructoid Article on 10/8/2009.